Since GNOME 3 took away the 'Shut Down...' menu option by default, after installing F15 from the desktop live you're left in the odd position of having a screen that says "Please reboot to use the installed system' with no obvious way of rebooting the system (unless you figure out either the 'hold down alt' or 'log out first' dodges). Part of the upstream rationale behind this change is that rebooting is only rarely necessary, and in those cases, the things that make it necessary should provide a reboot mechanism, as PackageKit does when you install updates that recommend a reboot. So, following that theory, anaconda should provide a 'Reboot' button on the final screen of the live install process (at present there's only a greyed-out Back button and a Close button which quits the installer).
this is probably worth documenting for f15, and it'll give us a place to write up the relevant dodges... -- Fedora Bugzappers volunteer triage team https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/BugZappers
Click on 'Live System User', then Click on 'Shut Down'. I don't see any need to add this to Anaconda.
That's only there in fallback mode. It's not there in Shell mode. -- Fedora Bugzappers volunteer triage team https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/BugZappers
-- Fedora Bugzappers volunteer triage team https://fedoraproject.org/wiki/BugZappers
regarding the dodgelist: one option would be a nice mouseover help bubble over the logout/switchuser/suspend options in the menu which could say something like 'hold <alt>key to enable reboot/powerdown choices' the mouseover help enabled by default but could be disabled with a checkbox in the forest of systemsettings
From the UX designer peanut gallery: PROS ==== Click the button, don't think about it, what you expect to happen happens (anaconda exits and newly-installed system boots) Users can actually boot into their newly-installed system. Since there is no reboot button in our default desktop environment, they might think the text in anaconda doesn't apply to them and they are already booted into their new system. Which has really bad repercussions. No snarky anti-Fedora tweets after the frustrating hunt for the restart button that anaconda's closing message refers to that does not actually exist. CONS ==== If people are doing stuff on the desktop while install is happening, then they are gonna lose their stuff. I can't think of any other cons. HOWEVER, to address the con: 1) If a user clicks on a button labeled 'reboot' and doesn't anticipate that the system will 'reboot'... their expectations may be a bit flawed. 2) Live installs are *fast*. I just installed F16 alpha live to an 8-year old, very slow x86 machine in 4 minutes. In 4 minutes, you'll not have produced much that would be heartbreaking to lose. Okay, so you could have done something before you started the install, but with F16 we will be auto-starting the anaconda window, so it's less likely you would delay running the installer. For the bug fix here, I would suggest relabeling the 'Exit' button and just making it reboot. I think having both an 'Exit' and a 'Reboot' button is going to be too confusing.
Discussed at the 2011-09-02 NTH review meeting. Accepted as NTH. Caveat: there is some disagreement over whether it actually makes sense to change this in anaconda, or whether it should be a desktop issue - this change is essentially a workaround for GNOME 3's lack of an obvious 'reboot' option. So for clarity: a bug being AcceptedNTH does not mean the change is required. anaconda team can certainly still reject this change despite it being AcceptedNTH. In the event that the underlying issue here is farmed off to the GNOME team, we should drop 'AcceptedNTH' and re-evaluate the bug, as the change required to 'fix' the issue on desktop end may be more intrusive than the change required on anaconda end.
From the GNOME perspective, rebooting is the last step of the installation, and a tool that tells you 'You may now do X' really should also offer a way to do X.
(In reply to comment #8) > From the GNOME perspective, rebooting is the last step of the installation, and > a tool that tells you 'You may now do X' really should also offer a way to do > X. Not when running from the desktop environment. It is up to the user to decide whether or not they want to reboot. This used to be just fine, until the reboot option was hidden from the users.
In the live environment, anaconda's really just another program - albeit one that can do a whole lot to the system. We've also been trying to make anaconda's environment as similar as the running system's as we can over time. Thus, I'd suggest that the reboot mechanism in the livecd be the same as the reboot mechanism in the installed system. So, what are users expected to do on an installed system in order to reboot?
Chris, on an installed GNOME system if you need to reboot: 1) You go to the menu under the right-most top menu in the top panel. 2) You hold down the 'Alt' key and an option to "Power Off..." appears. 3) A menu pops up that offers you three choices: Cancel Restart Power off This would be pretty clunky to explain verbally on the closing screen of Anaconda. Even if you were able to display this clunky explanation only in the case of live install and hide it in the case of a DVD install, the problem is that the other desktop environments do not have this path. From this, I think that simply adding 'documentation' to the final anaconda screen without changing the behavior in either Anaconda or GNOME is not an option. Why can't a reboot button not simply be added to the GNOME menu? I will do my best to explain why GNOME operates this way now (I may get some things wrong, apologies for that - it wasn't my decision): There is a belief that most desktop users of GNOME are laptop users, and they would prefer to suspend their system rather than power it off. This is similar to how you operate a smart phone or tablet: the system is meant to be in a perpetual state of being 'on', and you don't really turn it 'off' unless its battery dies in which case you have no choice. The notion here is that users are going to rely more heavily on having a consistent session in which case you wouldn't elect to shut down; rather you'd suspend and unsuspend indefinitely so all your applications and documents are just where you left them the last time you used the computer. The above I believe is reasonable and understandable; difficult is the leap as to why there is then only a single 'Suspend' option, the final and most difficult-to-target, in the menu when shutting the laptop lid is far easier. I have been told if the kernel reports that the system cannot reliably be suspended, that the 'Suspend' menu item is replaced with the 'Power Off...' menu item. Also, I believe the 'Power Off...' button is displayed in the GNOME 3 'fallback mode.' In my opinion, it would be best if the 'Power Off ...' option appeared in the menu whether or not the kernel reported suspend. As a user who uses GNOME 3 in just the prescribed manner as the designers apparently intended, I never use the menu to suspend; I shut my laptop lid. However, even if 'Power Off...' was there by default, you still have a single-desktop-specific clunky explanation for Anaconda, right? Because you have to go Menu > Power Off ... > Restart. I do not think it is a good idea to add a 'Restart' item to the menu here; the suspend-only menu has eight items in it; the menu would be too cluttered with additional items. It does really seem like the simplest fix here is simply having the Anaconda 'exit' button instead be a 'restart' button and to actually restart the machine. Help me understand the negative implications of this?
"There is a belief that most desktop users of GNOME are laptop users, and they would prefer to suspend their system rather than power it off." I think this is incorrect. It's more that suspending is considered the 'correct' action for _all_ users - not just laptop users. There was some indication in the original discussions that GNOME accepted the need for reboot operations in certain specific cases - system updates, and switching between OSes, were the two most commonly identified - and that these would be handled somehow as 'special cases'. I haven't seen any real discussion since then of how exactly that would be achieved. I guess we could consider 'post-live-install' to be another 'special case' which warrants a reboot action, and ask the GNOME designers to get their asses moving on the 'special case' mechanism in general.
Can you boot the live image with updates=http://clumens.fedorapeople.org/705189.img and let me know if it's fixed for you?
Created attachment 523230 [details] Screenshot of reboot button after live install on VM I used the updates image from comment 13 and there was a reboot button on the last window shown by anaconda. Clicking that reboot button did reboot the system.
anaconda-16.18-1.fc16 has been submitted as an update for Fedora 16. https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/anaconda-16.18-1.fc16
Package anaconda-16.18-1.fc16: * should fix your issue, * was pushed to the Fedora 16 testing repository, * should be available at your local mirror within two days. Update it with: # su -c 'yum update --enablerepo=updates-testing anaconda-16.18-1.fc16' as soon as you are able to. Please go to the following url: https://admin.fedoraproject.org/updates/anaconda-16.18-1.fc16 then log in and leave karma (feedback).
*** Bug 732906 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***
This patch caused a regression - now the computer reboots any time you close anaconda installer. That means it is enough to start anaconda and exit the installation at the first step and your computer is immediately restarted. The implementation clearly needs to be fixed.
And everyone wonders why we hate live installs so much. Every release brings yet another reason to take them away.
Does updates=http://clumens.fedorapeople.org/705189.img fix this up?
(In reply to comment #20) > Does updates=http://clumens.fedorapeople.org/705189.img fix this up? Nope. 1) When I close the installer using title bar, it restarts immediately. 2) When I choose "exit installer" on "this is a pre-release of fedora" dialog, it asks me "this will reboot your computer. [back] [reboot]". "[Back]" leads back to the dialog. Ugh :/
Got #1 figured out. #2 is how anaconda's always worked (at least, that's what the betanag code looks like to me). At this point, I don't really want to change it unless we absolutely have to.
as a process note, this is NTH, so if you wanted to revert the fix as it was causing too many problems, you could.
anaconda-16.18-1.fc16 has been pushed to the Fedora 16 stable repository. If problems still persist, please make note of it in this bug report.