Bug 1553758

(In reply to Marina from comment #0)
> We should add clarification about RHVM appliance, that it is used for
> initial deployment only and following upgrades should be done from within
> the appliance itself, as it has been any other machine.
> Specifically, check this kcs: https://access.redhat.com/solutions/2752071
> 
> Where to put that clarification?
> Somewhere in HE guide.
> Maybe under procedure 2.4, point 2 below, as a note:
> https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-us/red_hat_virtualization/4.1/
> html/self-hosted_engine_guide/deploying_self-hosted_engine
> 
> Or under separate chapter after the procedure is done.

if we are following this approach, we might want to technically prevent downloading the appliance every time there is an update to it, since it looks like a waste of time and space.

Moving to Integration, that's their field of domain

This bug has not been marked as blocker for oVirt 4.3.0.
Since we are releasing it tomorrow, January 29th, this bug has been re-targeted to 4.3.1.

To clarify:
- we don't ask the user to install the rhvm-appliance because the hosted-engine deployment takes care of doing it as part of the setup.
- once the deployment is complete there's no reason for keeping the appliance installed on the system, opened bug #1676825 for removing the rpm at the end of the deployment.

(In reply to Sandro Bonazzola from comment #8)
> To clarify:
> - we don't ask the user to install the rhvm-appliance because the
> hosted-engine deployment takes care of doing it as part of the setup.

user need to get the appliance installed on the system before trying to deploy hosted engine if connectivity won't be available during hosted engine deployment


> - once the deployment is complete there's no reason for keeping the
> appliance installed on the system, opened bug #1676825 for removing the rpm
> at the end of the deployment.

(In reply to Moran Goldboim from comment #1)
> 
> if we are following this approach, we might want to technically prevent
> downloading the appliance every time there is an update to it, since it
> looks like a waste of time and space.

Sounds to me like what you're describing should be a separate BZ.

(In reply to Marina from comment #0)
> We should add clarification about RHVM appliance, that it is used for
> initial deployment only and following upgrades should be done from within
> the appliance itself, as it has been any other machine.
> Specifically, check this kcs: https://access.redhat.com/solutions/2752071
> 
> Where to put that clarification?
> Somewhere in HE guide.
> Maybe under procedure 2.4, point 2 below, as a note:
> https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-us/red_hat_virtualization/4.1/
> html/self-hosted_engine_guide/deploying_self-hosted_engine
> 
> Or under separate chapter after the procedure is done.

I propose adding the following note: 

NOTE
The RHV-M Appliance is provided for the initial installation of the virtual machine that hosts the Manager. After installation, the appliance is not necessary. The appliance is not used when you upgrade the Manager.


I suggest putting this note into the following places:

* Intro to Chap 2 [1]
* Intro to Chap 8 (on upgrading) [2]

[1] https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-aus/red_hat_virtualization/4.2/html-single/self-hosted_engine_guide/#Deploying_the_Self-Hosted_Engine_Using_the_CLI_deploy
[2] https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-us/red_hat_virtualization/4.2/html-single/self-hosted_engine_guide/#Upgrading_the_Self-Hosted_Engine

Sandro,

As a newcomer to RHV, I found the whole concept of the appliance to be very confusing. When I looked up what an appliance is, I found that it's a self-contained system used for a specific purpose. However, the way we use the term in the documentation, it is only for installing the virtual machine that hosts the engine. BUT we use the term inconsistently, which leads to more confusion. Specifically:
* We use the term in the documentation, as I just mentioned, to refer to something that installs the virtual machine that hosts the engine.
* But in the current SHE, in section 2.2, step 7 [1], the command prompt refers to the appliance as the actual virtual machine, not just something used to install the vm:
  > Please provide the FQDN you would like to use for the engine appliance.
  > Note: This will be the FQDN of the engine VM you are now going to launch,
  > it should not point to the base host or to any other existing machine.
  > Engine VM FQDN:  manager.example.com
  > Please provide the domain name you would like to use for the engine appliance.
  > Engine VM domain: [example.com]

[1] https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-aus/red_hat_virtualization/4.2/html-single/self-hosted_engine_guide/#Deploying_the_Self-Hosted_Engine_Using_the_CLI_deploy

The command prompts and the documentation need to be in sync. The command prompts should be updated.

I addressed this bug in conjunction as part of bug 1671111, so I'm closing this one as a duplicate. Please take a look at but 1671111, comment 15.

*** This bug has been marked as a duplicate of bug 1671111 ***

(In reply to Steve Goodman from comment #12)
> Sandro,
> 
> As a newcomer to RHV, I found the whole concept of the appliance to be very
> confusing. When I looked up what an appliance is, I found that it's a
> self-contained system used for a specific purpose. However, the way we use
> the term in the documentation, it is only for installing the virtual machine
> that hosts the engine. BUT we use the term inconsistently, which leads to
> more confusion. Specifically:
> * We use the term in the documentation, as I just mentioned, to refer to
> something that installs the virtual machine that hosts the engine.
> * But in the current SHE, in section 2.2, step 7 [1], the command prompt
> refers to the appliance as the actual virtual machine, not just something
> used to install the vm:
>   > Please provide the FQDN you would like to use for the engine appliance.
>   > Note: This will be the FQDN of the engine VM you are now going to launch,
>   > it should not point to the base host or to any other existing machine.
>   > Engine VM FQDN:  manager.example.com
>   > Please provide the domain name you would like to use for the engine
> appliance.
>   > Engine VM domain: [example.com]
> 
> [1]
> https://access.redhat.com/documentation/en-aus/red_hat_virtualization/4.2/
> html-single/self-hosted_engine_guide/#Deploying_the_Self-
> Hosted_Engine_Using_the_CLI_deploy
> 
> The command prompts and the documentation need to be in sync. The command
> prompts should be updated.

Can you please open a BZ against ovirt-hosted-engine-setup for this?