RHEL Engineering is moving the tracking of its product development work on RHEL 6 through RHEL 9 to Red Hat Jira (issues.redhat.com). If you're a Red Hat customer, please continue to file support cases via the Red Hat customer portal. If you're not, please head to the "RHEL project" in Red Hat Jira and file new tickets here. Individual Bugzilla bugs in the statuses "NEW", "ASSIGNED", and "POST" are being migrated throughout September 2023. Bugs of Red Hat partners with an assigned Engineering Partner Manager (EPM) are migrated in late September as per pre-agreed dates. Bugs against components "kernel", "kernel-rt", and "kpatch" are only migrated if still in "NEW" or "ASSIGNED". If you cannot log in to RH Jira, please consult article #7032570. That failing, please send an e-mail to the RH Jira admins at rh-issues@redhat.com to troubleshoot your issue as a user management inquiry. The email creates a ServiceNow ticket with Red Hat. Individual Bugzilla bugs that are migrated will be moved to status "CLOSED", resolution "MIGRATED", and set with "MigratedToJIRA" in "Keywords". The link to the successor Jira issue will be found under "Links", have a little "two-footprint" icon next to it, and direct you to the "RHEL project" in Red Hat Jira (issue links are of type "https://issues.redhat.com/browse/RHEL-XXXX", where "X" is a digit). This same link will be available in a blue banner at the top of the page informing you that that bug has been migrated.
Bug 1260928 - RFE:- Request to have slew mode "-x" enabled by default in ntp instead of step mode.
Summary: RFE:- Request to have slew mode "-x" enabled by default in ntp instead of st...
Keywords:
Status: CLOSED NOTABUG
Alias: None
Product: Red Hat Enterprise Linux 6
Classification: Red Hat
Component: ntp
Version: 6.8
Hardware: All
OS: Linux
medium
medium
Target Milestone: rc
: ---
Assignee: Miroslav Lichvar
QA Contact: qe-baseos-daemons
URL:
Whiteboard:
Depends On:
Blocks:
TreeView+ depends on / blocked
 
Reported: 2015-09-08 08:58 UTC by Rupesh Patel
Modified: 2019-09-12 08:52 UTC (History)
1 user (show)

Fixed In Version:
Doc Type: Enhancement
Doc Text:
Cause: Consequence: Fix: Result:
Clone Of:
Environment:
Last Closed: 2015-10-15 08:11:54 UTC
Target Upstream Version:
Embargoed:


Attachments (Terms of Use)

Description Rupesh Patel 2015-09-08 08:58:57 UTC
Would it be acceptable to have slew mode enabled by default?

Comment 3 Miroslav Lichvar 2015-09-08 09:35:54 UTC
The -x option is useful to keep the clock monotonic, but the clock is inaccurate for very long time when the offset is large. That's not acceptable for default configuration. Also, it disables the kernel discipline, which usually makes the quality of the timekeeping worse.

Comment 4 Ash 2015-09-08 22:57:00 UTC
Actually the request is as per Red Hat case 01492484.

Summary Text (TL;DR)
Any method of adjusting time that relies on time stepping backwards is the worst method. Pick some other method. As long as it does not involve time stepping backwards (which is absolutely ridiculous).

Full Text: 

Request feature enhancement by Red Hat to ensure 'slew mode' of NTP clients is the default and *always* the default (e.g. during leap seconds). I know it is configurable, but what proportion of customers would ever, ever want 'step' mode during leap seconds?

Whoever decided that the correct approach to handling leap seconds should involve time 'stepping backwards' must live in a universe where transactional systems don't exist.

I'd argue that the majority of your customers don't care. However, those that do care would prefer 'slew always'.  The small percentage of your customers who want accurate time with the real world still would not use the Linux implementation of jumping time backwards.

For example: the Australian Stock Exchange:http://www.sfe.com.au/content/notices/2015/0291.15.03.pdf

ASX’s Trading platforms will Manage all transactions in the sequence they are received. Progress time forward as the time synchronisation will occur by slewing the time, not by moving the time backwards, or repeating the time.

The Linux implementation of leap seconds is absolutely ridiculous. Windows actually caused less problems simply because it ignores leap seconds.

Comment 5 Miroslav Lichvar 2015-10-15 08:11:54 UTC
I think there are basically three criteria when handling an inserted leap second:

A) for how long is the time inaccurate? (it can't be shorter than 1 second due to missing representation of the 23:59:60 UTC second on the Unix timescale)
B) is the time monotonic?
C) do clocks of computers in the network stay close to each other?

If we evaluate them for the -x option, we get:

          |  A          |   B       |   C
ntpd      |  1 second   |   no      |   yes
ntpd -x   |  >1 day     |   yes     |   no

By enabling the -x option we trade A+C for B.

In both B and C are important, it's necessary to use a leap smearing NTP server that will hide the leap second from the client ntpd and in that case it doesn't matter if it uses -x or not.

          |  A          |   B       |   C
ntpd      |  1 day      |   yes     |   yes
ntpd -x   |  1 day      |   yes     |   yes

For more information see
http://developerblog.redhat.com/2015/06/01/five-different-ways-handle-leap-seconds-ntp/

Even if we ignore the problems with extremely long correction of the initial offset and worse timekeeping performance due to disabled kernel discipline, the leap second behavior of -x is not always preferred and some users would need to disable it if it was enabled by default. The current default behavior is known and adding -x needs to be an informed decision. In cases where the time must be monotonic and also stay close to other hosts in the network, enabling -x wouldn't help anyway.

Comment 6 Ash 2015-10-15 10:52:54 UTC
Few points:

1. Is there not an option that will satisfy A, B and C?

2. If I were to rank A, B and C in terms of priority; most of your customers don't care. But those that do care, would rank B highest priority.

3. Again, any method of adjusting time that relies on time stepping backwards is absolutely ridiculous.


Note You need to log in before you can comment on or make changes to this bug.