Bug 6052 - power management messes up clock
Summary: power management messes up clock
Alias: None
Product: Red Hat Linux
Classification: Retired
Component: apmd
Version: 6.1
Hardware: i386
OS: Linux
Target Milestone: ---
Assignee: Erik Troan
QA Contact:
: 2396 3744 (view as bug list)
Depends On:
TreeView+ depends on / blocked
Reported: 1999-10-18 14:03 UTC by Luca Bonomi
Modified: 2008-05-01 15:37 UTC (History)
5 users (show)

Fixed In Version:
Doc Type: Bug Fix
Doc Text:
Clone Of:
Last Closed: 1999-11-11 15:51:43 UTC

Attachments (Terms of Use)

Description Luca Bonomi 1999-10-18 14:03:19 UTC
This bug seems to be reported different times and it is
still present in Red Hat 6.1.
Past references are bugs #2396, #3661, #3744. Note that bugs
#2396 and #3661 are declared RESOLVED. Please, REOPEN them.

I'm running the following rpms (coming with a standard Red
Hat 6.1):

My time zone is CEST (Europe/Copenhagen).

The problem: if the hwclock is set to local time and the
machine goes into power saving mode (whether it's BIOS or
apm doesn't really matter), my system time is moved two
hours ahead (this is the difference in time between UTC and
CEST, so it acts as if the hwclock, our only reference
when resuming from power save, was set to UTC).

More than that, 'linuxconf' and 'timeconfig/setclock' seem
to be incoherent when writing '/etc/sysconfig/clock' and
setting the hwclock.

It seems we are facing two bugs here.

First: the system (kernel??, apm?? - Bug 3744, comment
08/30/99 10:01 mention this) doesn't check whether the
hwclock is UTC or 'local time' when resuming from power
save. It always assume UTC!

Second: we assume our hwclock must be UTC. 'linuxconf' then
writes the following '/etc/sysconfig/clock' configuration.

# cat /etc/sysconfig/clock

The value "yes" for variable UTC is not understood by
'/usr/sbin/setclock'. So if you use 'setclock' with such a
configuration file, you end up setting your hwclock as
'local time'! This will obviously mess the clock next time
you go power save (e.g. try 'apm -S' as root).

Note that 'timeconfig' writes this '/etc/sysconfig/clock'
instead (good for 'setclock'):

# cat /etc/sysconfig/clock

so the various clock commands seem to disagree on how to set
the hwclock!

In my opinion, the system should handle hwclock both as UTC
or local time with no problems (i.e. check correctly if the
hwclock is UTC or not), and the various time configuration
tools should agree on how to handle the two cases

Comment 1 Bill Nottingham 1999-10-18 14:26:59 UTC
*** Bug 2396 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

The system clock on my laptop was set to UTC and my timezone
was set to Europe/Amsterdam (which is now UTC+2 and reported
as CEST).  After I upgraded to Redhat 6.0, the time was
reported correctly as UTC+2 upon the initial boot. However,
when I suspended the machine and then resumed, this changed
and the date command was reporting UTC instead of UTC+2.
Rebooting set the reported time back to UTC+2, but every
time i suspended, it went back 2 hours to UTC.  A workaround
that seems to do the trick for now is to set the system
clock to local time instead of UTC.  When I do this, date
reports a time 2 hrs fast immediately after resuming, but
within a few seconds it returns to reporting the correct

I'm using the stock kernel and apmd that were installed by
redhat 6.0 which was installed as an upgrade over redhat
5.2.  i was previously using the stock redhat 5.2 apmd along
with a custom 2.2.1 kernel. The machine is a Toshiba Tecra

------- Additional Comments From jbj  05/14/99 16:24 -------

*** Bug 2783 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

My machine is a regular desktop, but I have power-saving
settings currently on (in my BIOS).  Whenver the machine
goes into suspend mode and comes back, the clock is set
forward.  I'm not sure what the magic formula is --
sometimes it seems to be set forward 20 minutes, sometimes 4

The only workaround I can figure out at the moment is to
disable energy-saving mode from the BIOS.

------- Additional Comments From yminsky.edu  05/12/99 22:43 -------
Further information about the bug:  it appears that what happens is
that when the resume occurs, the timezone is ignored and the hwclock
value is directly set to the real clock value.  That, at least,
explains the cases I've run up against with the 4 hour move.  I'm not
sure about the 30-minute shift, but I can't replicate that one yet

------- Additional Comments From notting  05/13/99 10:15 -------
Try grabbing the latest apmd package from Raw Hide; alternatively,
start apmd with the '-u' option if your system clock is
in UTC. Does that help?

------- Additional Comments From yminsky.edu  05/13/99 13:37 -------
I switched over to storing my clock in regular time, not UTC (using
linuxconf) and the problem still persists, sort of.  Now, when I do
apm -s, it wakes up with the right time, but when I do apm -S, it
wakes up with the time set BACK by four hours.  This is with the
newest apm installed from the updates directory.  I haven't tried the
RawHide package.  The command line invocation for apmd (according to
ps) is:

    /usr/sbin/apmd -p 10 -w 5 -W

------- Additional Comments From yminsky.edu  05/13/99 21:41 -------
One more addition:  When time is stored as UTC, then:
  return from apm -s sets time FORWARD four hours
  return from apm -S doesn't mess up the clock

when time is not stored as UTC, then:
  return from apm -s doesn't mess up clock
  return from apm -S sets clock four hours BACKWARDS

This would suggest that restoring from apm -s always assumes non-UTC,
and restoring from apm -S always assumes UTC.  But this is almost too
odd to believe.

------- Additional Comments From jbj  05/14/99 16:25 -------

*** Bug 2768 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

I'm using an HP Omnibook 800CT. when I boot up RedHat 6.0,
everything goes fine until the screen clears and the
initial login prompt appears....in order to get any
interaction, I must suspend the machine, then unsuspend it.
After that, everything works fine.

I also noticed the same problem in the installation - when
the install finishes with the RPMs, I must
suspend/unsuspend in order to be able to continue
interactive with the system. I'm assuming it's a problem
with the APM, since suspend/unsuspend fixes it...

------- Additional Comments From yminsky.edu  05/17/99 12:59 -------
Having put in the latest version of apmd, the system works well when
the clock is stored in UTC, but jumps backwards in time when the clock
is stored in local time.

------- Additional Comments From dkl  06/14/99 19:56 -------
An apmd update has been placed on the updates.redhat.com ftp site to
fix some of these issues. Please obtain and install the update and see
if this solves your problem. If not, please reopen the bug.

------- Additional Comments From jbj  06/23/99 10:36 -------

*** Bug 3661 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

This might reopen Bug #2396

I have installed the latest apmd package:
<68> rpm -qa|grep apm

My timezone is:
/etc/localtime -> ../usr/share/zoneinfo/Europe/Copenhagen

My hwclock is set to localtime.

Running apm -s (or -S) puts the machine time two hours ahead
after wake up. No changes are made to the timezone.

I see the same problem on some of my machines, which happen
to enter sleep mode after a while. I wonder why some of them
enter sleep mode, while others do not, since I have followed
the same installation procedures and all the motherboards
respond to apm.
Is there any other way to control the suspend mode? Is that
buggy as well?

------- Additional Comments From mcb.com  09/22/99 13:52 -------
I also see this clock problem, even though apmd is turned off.
Does something activate apm even on desktop machines when everything
claims apm is unused?  At this point I'm inclined to believe that
something else is the culprit.  Also makes more sense that two
separate packages would have different expectations of the hardware
clock being UTC or not, than that one package had split opinions.
-- Mark Beutnagel -- mcb.com

Comment 2 Bill Nottingham 1999-10-18 14:27:59 UTC
*** Bug 3744 has been marked as a duplicate of this bug. ***

I realize that there was already an errata notice
about APMd losing time.

I syncronized my clock using NTP.

I then left the computer for a while.

I came back, and the clock was off by 30 minutes.

[root@slacker pietb]# /usr/sbin/ntpdate tock.cs.unlv.edu
26 Jun 09:44:38 ntpdate[1108]: step time server
offset -76.758548 sec
[root@slacker pietb]# /usr/sbin/ntpdate tock.cs.unlv.edu
26 Jun 09:44:41 ntpdate[1109]: adjust time server offset 0.006088 sec
[root@slacker pietb]# /usr/sbin/ntpdate tock.cs.unlv.edu
26 Jun 09:44:44 ntpdate[1110]: adjust time server offset 0.003191 sec
[root@slacker pietb]# date
Sat Jun 26 09:49:10 EDT 1999

[went out to breakfast, came back]

[root@slacker pietb]# /usr/sbin/ntpdate tock.cs.unlv.edu
26 Jun 12:11:52 ntpdate[1198]: step time server
offset 2040.635256 sec
[root@slacker pietb]#

[root@slacker rc3.d]# rpm -q apmd

Here's /var/log/messages

Jun 26 09:02:33 slacker syslogd 1.3-3: restart.
Jun 26 06:46:09 slacker apmd[128]: Resume after
4294967292:4294967295:4294967239 (-1% unknown)
Jun 26 07:30:23 slacker apmd[128]: Resume after 00:44:14
(-1% unknown)
Jun 26 11:30:23 slacker apmd[128]: Resume after 04:00:00
(-1% unknown)
Jun 26 11:31:08 slacker PAM_pwdb[1171]: (su) session opened
for user root by pietb(uid=500)

I haven't verified that the clock isn't busted, but I don't
get the time warp in Windows.

------- Additional Comments From jbj  06/26/99 22:38 -------
You can't expect xntpd -- a program that requires a running cpu
to keep track of time -- if you run another program apmd that stops
the cpu from running.

You don't get the time warp in Windows because Windows just
reads the battery backed up hardware clock and uses that as
the system time. You also don't get a system time on windows that
is usually within 10 ms of a primary reference clock on windows
either; that's the funxtion that xntpd performs that requires a
running cpu.

------- Additional Comments From pietb  06/27/99 22:50 -------
Umm.  Perhaps you misunderstood.

After screen blanks out from APMd, I lose an half an hour!  More than
once!!  With striking regularity!

The ntpdate shows how much drift is being caused by the apm daemon.
The example I showed had 2000 seconds.   THAT'S SIGNIFICANT!

The clock isn't busted, I just spent hours in 95, and no time drift.

it apmd.

I know it.

I'm re-opening the bug.

------- Additional Comments From pietb  06/27/99 22:51 -------
Umm.  Perhaps you misunderstood.

After screen blanks out from APMd, I lose an half an hour!  More than
once!!  With striking regularity!

The ntpdate shows how much drift is being caused by the apm daemon.
The example I showed had 2000 seconds.   THAT'S SIGNIFICANT!

The clock isn't busted, I just spent hours in 95, and no time drift.

it apmd.

I know it.

I'm re-oThe first issue is a kernel issue - it's most likely compiled


As for the second, linuxconf is broken. A workaround
is in timeconfig-3.0.1-1, which will be in the next Raw Hide release.pening the bug.

------- Additional Comments From yminsky.edu  08/28/99 12:53 -------
I have similar APMD problems, and I'm not running xntpd.

Here's what I've found.  Sometimes, when my laptop wakes up, the time
is set wrong.  Not reliably, tough.  I store my time in real time (not
UTC), and there seems to be some problems with that.  The following is
the output of repeated executions of "date" when I put the machine to
sleep and then wake it up.

snapdragon: init.d $ while true; sleep 1; do date; done
Sat Aug 28 12:46:38 PM EDT
Sat Aug 28 12:46:39 PM EDT
Sat Aug 28 12:46:40 PM EDT
Sat Aug 28 12:46:41 PM EDT
Sat Aug 28 12:46:42 PM EDT
Sat Aug 28 12:46:43 PM EDT
Sat Aug 28 12:46:44 PM EDT
Sat Aug 28  8:47:16 AM EDT
Sat Aug 28  8:47:18 AM EDT
Sat Aug 28 12:47:18 PM EDT
Sat Aug 28 12:47:19 PM EDT

In other words, when it wakes up, it temporarily restores the time as
if it was stored in UTC, and then immediatly (within 2 seconds)
switches it back.  THis is the "good" outcome, since the date finally
reaches the right value.  But it's still weird.  And sometimes, I'm
not sure why or when, I leave it for a while and find it set on the
wrong time, that is, set to the time it would be if I stored the date
in UTC.

This is really a bit weird.  I fixed a similar problem on my desktop
some time ago by changing /etc/sysconfig/clock so that instead of


it read:


That fixed some problems, but I did the same thing on my laptop to no

I'm running Linux on a Dell Solo 2500.  (lovely machine, btw.;)

------- Additional Comments From jbj  08/28/99 17:47 -------
Running APM and xntp makes no sense since the xntpd requires
periodic time stamps every 1-60 seconds while apmd turns off
the cpu. Run ntpdate every 5 mins from cron to synchronize with a
server if you wish to work around the problem.

------- Additional Comments From yminsky.edu  08/29/99 10:28 -------
I'm not sure if the above response from jbj@redhat is to my post, but
let me reiterate: I am NOT using xntpd.  I find similar problems even
so.  So whether or not it's a good idea to use xntpd on a laptop is

------- Additional Comments From   08/30/99 10:01 -------
After reading recent comments, I went in and recompiled my kernel --
I set the setting that time is local instead of UTC (it's in the Power
Management settings section), and now every time the apm daemon
launches, I don't lose 4 hours anymore.

That was it, you see.  When apm started, I would be losing around
14,400 seconds -- about 4 hours. It never made much sense to me as to
why I was losing about the same amount of time with each apm suspend.

The apm daemon *should* be able to figure out the difference between
which mode the system is in, without requiring a recompilation of the

Comment 3 Bernhard Rosenkraenzer 1999-11-11 15:51:59 UTC
Get the apmd package from Raw Hide (3.0beta9-4) - and make sure to add
-u to ADDPARAMS in /etc/sysconfig/console if your system clock is set
to UTC.

Comment 4 Joe Harrington 1999-11-23 17:12:59 UTC
Please REOPEN this bug.  Sorry, it isn't quite fixed, even in Raw Hide's
apmd-3.0beta9-4, and there are numerous documentation issues that have
contributed to the pain of solving this problem.

I'm on a Toshiba Tecra 8000 in EST (UTC-5:00).  I set the UTC variable in
/etc/sysconfig/clock to true, false, yes, and no, and either did or didn't
include a -u in the ADDPARAMS variable of /etc/sysconfig/apmd.  I tested all 8
permutations.  After saving the files each time, I did:

/etc/rc.d/init.d/apmd restart ; rdate -s ntp1 ; setclock ; date

Then I suspended and restarted twice, repeating the "date" command many times in
succession during the restarts and watching the syslog messages.  In each case,
the time came back set to an initial value and was then advanced 5 hours.
Sometimes this was done incorrectly, and frequently it was done against the
instructions of the files.

Here's the truth table.

clock	apmd	initial	final
yes	-u	-5 hr	correct
true	-u	correct	+5 hr
no	-u	-5 hr	correct
false	-u	-5 hr	correct
yes		-5 hr	correct
true		correct	+5 hr
no		-5 hr	correct
false		-5 hr	correct

BUG 1: If the UTC variable in /etc/sysconfig/clock is set to true, the behavior
is incorrect.  Unfortunately, this is the value that timeconfig sets it to,
rather than yes.

FIX 1: timeconfig should set it to yes, not true, and everyone reading the file
should understand both true and yes.  Document the favored value to use in the
timeconfig and sysconfig man pages.  Document the format of the
/etc/sysconfig/clock file either on its own page or in timeconfig or sysconfig's
pages.  Currently its format is undocumented in the reference pages.

BUG 2: The -u command line option to apmd, documented under comments of the
ADDPARAMS variable of /etc/sysconfig/apmd, is completely ignored.

FIX 2: The man page says the option is ignored.  However, it also says the
hardware clock is in UTC, which may be incorrect.  The man page should be
updated.  The /etc/sysconfig/apmd file should have reference to -u removed.
The lines in /etc/rc.d/init.d/apmd that ensure the -u option is set if UTC is
set in /etc/sysconfig/clock, are not effective as they set a variable that is
never referred to.

The man pages for timeconfig, settime, and apmd refer to a program clock(8),
which doesn't exist and neither does its man page.  The correct reference and
program are "hwclock".  The man page for hwclock says it is the man page for
clock(8).  The man page for apmd doesn't give a section number after referring
to hwclock.  The man page for setclock doesn't name a program for reading the
hardware clock, but should name hwclock and state its function.

After all of this, there is still another problem.  If I suspend with apm -s or
by holding the power button in for 1 second (configured in the BIOS to suspend),
things work fine if I'm configured with one of the methods that work above.
However, this laptop has an emergency suspend when the battery runs out.  When
there is no power in the main batteries, it suspends and switches to a backup
battery that keeps the system alive for 8 hours in suspend mode only.  Resuming
from one of these suspends causes the clock to lose 5 hours and not get it back.


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